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The Neuroscience of Quitting Porn | Build a New Brain By Changing Habit Patterns, Fixing Dopamine, Altering Nutrition, Transforming Identity, and Finding Deeper Meaning



Man's hands with a brain floating above them - neuroscience representation

Quitting porn is not about trying hard enough. You could muster all the will in the world and never overcome it. Unless you know how. My conversation today is with George Haymaker. We discuss the neuroscience of quitting porn, how to change habit patterns and rewire your brain


George is an inspiring man with an incredible story. He’s helped many people heal their brains and change their habits for the better. He is a certified neuroscience coach & consultant, and an impressive entrepreneur with a long history of successful business ventures. 


George helps addicts overcome their destructive patterns by teaching them sound practices for step-by-step habit change based on principles of neuroscience. He has his own history with addiction to pain pills and alcohol, which nearly took everything from him, including his career and his family. And while we may think of substance addictions as different from porn or sex addiction, many of the methods to recover are the same. 


In today’s episode, George shares his story of transformation, and the habits and teachings that have taken him from a life of stress, craving, anxiety, and addiction to a life of peace, joy, strong connections, and a career helping those in need. 


I hope our conversation today gives you crucial insights for your own porn recovery, or compassion for a loved one who’s struggling with pornography addiction, and an understanding for the methods that can truly set you free from porn


Below, I discuss some takeaways from the episode, as well as additional insights and tips for porn addiction recovery.


You can find George Haymaker, Certified Neuroscience Coach & Consultant, at georgehaymaker.com or LinkedIn


The Neuroscience Behind Quitting Porn Addiction


But the good news? You can rewire your brain and experience real, lasting change. The science of neuroplasticity, behavior modification, and identity transformation all point toward a clear path forward.


In this article, we’ll dive deep into the neuroscience of how to stop porn addiction and rebuild your brain. We’ll explore how to change habit patterns, repair dopamine imbalances, alter nutrition for sobriety and mental well-being, transform your identity, and find deeper meaning.


The Habit Loop: Why Quitting Porn Feels Impossible

Porn addiction is a learned habit that follows a predictable loop: cue → craving → response → reward. You may be unconscious of the initial cue. Maybe you feel stressed, lonely, or bored, and that triggers an urge to seek relief. You open a browser, watch porn, and experience a dopamine rush—temporarily numbing the discomfort. But as soon as the high fades, shame and regret set in. 


This shame and regret doesn’t stop you from returning to the behavior, but instead reinforces the habit, as the brain pays attention to what is emotionally potent. When you add fear and shame to a behavior it can cause your unconscious mind to pursue it again and again in order to reexperience that emotional intensity. 


The key to breaking free of porn? Interrupting the loop. Instead of seeking dopamine spikes through artificial means, you can retrain your brain to find fulfillment in healthier, more meaningful activities. The brain is incredibly adaptable, and with time, new habits can override old ones.


Action Steps

Identify your triggers and change your response before the craving takes over.

✔ Replace porn with healthier dopamine-boosting activities like exercise, deep conversations, and creative hobbies.

Practice mindfulness to catch urges early and choose a different response.


Free Workshop to Overcome Porn Addiction | Jake Kastleman with No More Desire

Fixing Dopamine: Rebalancing Your Brain’s Reward System

Pornography floods your brain with unnatural levels of dopamine, leading to desensitization. Over time, real-life pleasures—like relationships, achievements, and personal growth—start to feel dull in comparison.


Overcoming this desensitization takes time. You need to reset your dopamine system by engaging in activities that provide long-term, sustainable rewards. At first they may feel underwhelming, but if you can push through the initial weeks or months of this “slogging through the mud” feeling as you are going through porn withdrawal, your brain will eventually rewire itself, and then these activities will feel the way they should: satisfying. 


Ways to Restore Healthy Dopamine Levels

Exercise regularly – Physical movement increases dopamine naturally and helps you feel good without artificial highs. 

Cold exposure – Cold showers or ice baths stimulate dopamine production, boosting mental resilience

Delay gratification – By foregoing instant pleasure, your brain strengthens its ability to find fulfillment in real, meaningful experiences. 

Engage in deep work – Focused, challenging activities help rewire the brain’s reward system toward intrinsic motivation rather than external stimulation.


When you quit porn and allow your dopamine levels to stabilize, your brain starts responding to real-life pleasures again. Over time, you’ll find joy in genuine connection, purposeful work, and personal growth. Be patient and compassionate towards yourself throughout this process as your brain heals and leaves the addictions behind. 


Nutrition and Porn Recovery: How Your Diet Impacts Sobriety

What you eat directly impacts porn recovery by affecting your brain’s susceptibility to cravings.


A diet filled with processed junk food and sugar leads to inflammation, unstable blood sugar, and erratic dopamine levels. This can increase the frequency and intensity of porn cravings, making it harder to overcome porn addiction.


Brain-Boosting Foods for Porn Recovery

Healthy fats (avocados, nuts, salmon) support brain function and emotional stability. 

Protein-rich foods (eggs, lean meats, legumes) help balance dopamine levels

Complex carbohydrates (quinoa, sweet potatoes, oats) provide steady energy and reduce mood swings. 

Antioxidant-rich foods (berries, dark leafy greens) combat inflammation and improve mental clarity.


Instead of chasing short-lived dopamine spikes from porn or junk food, nourish your brain with real, wholesome nutrients. The result? A sharper mind, stronger self-control, and a more stable emotional state. These are all crucial components of the porn recovery mindset


Overcome Porn Triggers - The Ultimate Guidebook - 10 Tools to Conquer Porn Cravings

Transforming Your Identity: Aligning Yourself with a Recovery Lifestyle

The biggest breakthrough in quitting porn happens when you shift your identity—not just your behavior. If you see yourself as a porn addict struggling to break free, you’re reinforcing the cycle. But if you start viewing yourself as a person who values integrity, self-control, and authentic relationships, your actions will begin to align with that identity over time. 


How to Shift Your Identity

Use identity-based affirmations – Instead of saying, “I’m trying to quit porn,” say, “I am the kind of person who respects my mind and body.” 

Surround yourself with people who reflect your new identity – Join a recovery group, find mentors, and engage with people who uplift you. 

Align your habits with your values – Your daily actions should reinforce the person you want to become. Take small steps each day to seek a higher way of living. 

Track small wins – Each day without porn is a vote for your new identity. Celebrate progress.


When your values, behaviors, and identity align, you have greater power and motivation to quit porn. It isn’t just about willpower—it’s about becoming a better version of yourself. 


Finding Deeper Meaning: Why Purpose is the Ultimate Cure for Porn Addiction

One of the biggest reasons people struggle to quit porn is because they lack a compelling reason to stay sober. When your life feels empty, porn fills the void. But when you find a purpose greater than yourself, the need for porn fades.


Ways to Cultivate Meaning

Develop a spiritual practice – Whether it’s prayer, meditation, or studying sacred texts, connecting with something greater than yourself brings lasting fulfillment. 

Serve others – Helping people in need provides deep satisfaction that porn can never replicate. 

Create something valuable – Whether it’s art, music, writing, or building a business, channel your energy into something meaningful. 

Commit to lifelong growth – The journey of self-improvement brings profound joy and motivation.


When you pursue a purpose-driven life, the artificial pleasure of porn loses its grip. Your brain starts rewarding you with authentic joy, peace, and fulfillment.


The Path to Freedom From Porn Addiction

Quitting porn isn’t about deprivation—it’s about upgrading your life. By changing your habits, restoring your brain chemistry, nourishing your body, transforming your identity, and embracing deeper meaning, you’re not just quitting an addiction—you’re building a new version of yourself.


The neuroscience of porn addiction shows us that it is extremely addictive, but it also shows us that addiction can be replaced by a higher way of living. 


No more porn. No more shame. No more living out of alignment with your values.


This is your time to break free of porn and step into the life you want for yourself and your loved ones.


The brain is forgiving. Change is possible. And the path to recovery is worth every step.


Build the No More Porn Lifestyle







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Transcription of Episode 90: The Neuroscience of Quitting Porn | Build a New Brain By Changing Habit Patterns, Fixing Dopamine, Altering Nutrition, Transforming Identity, and Finding Deeper Meaning

This is Jake Castleman, welcome to No More Desire. My conversation today is with George Haymaker, an inspiring man with an incredible story. He's helped many people heal their brains and change their habits for the better, and he's a certified neuroscience coach and consultant and an impressive entrepreneur with a long history of successful business ventures. Amongst his work with professionals and couples, George also helps addicts overcome their destructive patterns by teaching them sound practices


for step-by-step habit change based on principles of neuroscience. He has his own history with addiction to pain pills and alcohol, which nearly took everything from him, including his career and his family. And while we may think of substance addictions as different from porn or sex addiction, many of the methods to recover are the same. In today's episode,


George shares his story of transformation in the habits and teachings that have taken him from a life of stress, craving, anxiety, and addiction to a life of peace, joy, strong connections, and a career helping those in need. Besides all this, George is just simply a down-to-earth guy, and it's been a privilege for me to get to know him. I believe our conversation today will give you some crucial insights for your own recovery or compassion for a loved one.


who's struggling and an understanding for the methods that can truly set you free. You can find George Haymaker, certified neuroscience coach and consultant at georgehaymaker.com or on LinkedIn. And if today's episode is helpful for you, please follow this podcast, hit the notification button and shoot me a rating as it will help me reach more men who need to hear these messages and help their families heal. With that,


We'll get started.


George, welcome to the show, my friend. It's awesome to have you on. I, learning about you and what you do, especially in our previous conversation, I was really inspired.


It was just so cool to hear your perspective, your knowledge, your training. So it's great to have you on, man. Thanks, Jake.


Great to be here. What a fun thing to do on a Monday morning. Thanks for having me.


That's right. Fun thing on an early Monday morning. So tell me first off, I think, I think what one of the things that I love about you is your story, where you come from, and you know, you share that on your side, you share that with, with people.


What did your life used to look like, especially with reference to your addiction, but maybe overall as well? Yeah, so I'm coming up on my 65th birthday. So there's a bit of history there. But yeah, why don't you? Why don't you start from when you were first born? And the last 65 years, that'll be an interesting conversation.


That'll tune people out pretty quickly. But um, yeah, let's just say that it wasn't going great. I was saddled with a lot of uncomfortable thoughts and emotions and behaviors that I just didn't know what to do with them.


And they, you know, the genesis was childhood, but I carried with them with me into adulthood, and I just was struggling. A lot of discomfort, a lot of activation in my nervous system, high stress all the time. Defensive, angry, impatient, just a lot of uncomfortable thoughts traveling through my head, you know, quick to react.


And so I just live my life that way. And you know, it's just not pleasant, right? Always activated. Things are never enough.


Always having to have more. You're not good enough. You need to do this, you need to do that.


And so, you know, just the underlying discomfort that I felt was unpleasant and highly active. And then, you know, I just got tired of it. And so along the way, I was coping through the use of addictive substances.


And which only made it worse, right? Because when you abuse chemicals like that, it just further inflames and activates your nervous system, and just makes the underlying discomfort only worse. It's like, you know, gasoline on a fire. And so, as addiction will do, it's progressive, and it got worse and worse.


But that was really my adult life up until the age of about 50. And, you know, I was an entrepreneur. So that was, I was working in high stress environments all the time.


So you start putting all these pieces together. And it just wasn't, I wasn't happy, wasn't fulfilled. Didn't know why, didn't know what to do about it.


Was there anything I could do about it? I just felt like this is who I was, and what was given to me. And this is just the way it was. And I didn't spend any time contemplating if there was some way to do things differently.


And so I hit a bottom. The age of 52, with, you know, pain pills and alcohol. And, and I just, it just was the end of the road for me.


You know, I just had put off changing. And just kept, you know, heading down that path I was on and until the path had come to an end, and there was a wall at the end of it, and I hit it hard. And that was the moment of truth, right? To figure out, was there going to be a different way of life for me? Tell me about that end.


George, what does that look like? Painful. You know, I, I was pretty good at addiction. So I, I took it to, I used to be really good at addiction too.


It was one of my greatest strengths. Yeah. I managed to get addicted to, to anything and everything too, you know, whatever behavior or substance it was, you know? Yeah.


So there are some predispositions and habit forming that goes around, go, go along with becoming very good at addiction, whether it's substances or behaviors or you name it. And we can get into that in a little bit in terms of neuroscience around it, but yeah, so it was really ugly. I scared my wife off.


I, you know, I, by that time I had three DUIs, I'd hit a couple of cars with people in it. Fortunately, nobody was seriously hurt. Consequences were piling up.


My wife had left temporarily and I was all alone at home taking 50 pain pills a day and drinking two bottles of vodka. It just, I crossed the line where my use was no longer impulsive. It was compulsive.


I just had to keep using in order to stop the withdrawals. So it was ugly. And you know, I, I, I knew I had to, I knew I had to get into rehab.


It just was something I had been avoiding, but so that, that, that I remember that morning, like it was yesterday where I, um, I, I made the calls on Friday night, I suffered all weekend and they were taking in new patients on Monday. And so I got a friend to take me into rehab and, and that's where it started, you know, and, uh, it's been, uh, the road to recovery, uh, has been wonderful. Uh, it was tough at the beginning, but, um, well worth it in the end.


So I, I have multiple questions on that one. Your, your wife, you said she left you temporarily. So you guys are still together now.


Is that correct? Yeah. For whatever reason, uh, she's still here. Um, she's just, she's the saint.


Um, she's, she's, she's either, she's either totally amazing or completely insane. Probably a little bit of both. Um, and as you know, in addiction, um, it's not just us who are suffering, uh, it's all the people around us.


And so I had put her through a great deal. Um, and I still feel deeply about that. And I, it's one of the core motivating factors of me trying to be the best version of myself is to be a good partner for her and, you know, try to make up for the, you know, the time that, you know, wasn't that way.


So, um, yeah. Um, I, I actually, I, I, I love what you've just said, George, because I think it reflects a, I think it reflects an attitude that has to come with true long lasting recovery, which is this ownership of what we've done in the past and saying, this is where I was, this is the impact that it had on my loved ones and feeling a real remorse for that. Not a, cause I think it's very easy to conflate that and you're already smiling and nodding your head, conflate it with a self-centered shaming.


I'm so bad. I'm so terrible. What's wrong with me? I think it's very easy to conflate that with this very real and something that's completely different, which is that it's that ownership is an accountability.


It's I accept what I did. How, how did you find that? Cause this is really relevant to so many who are trapped in addiction, especially with something like porn addiction, which can be just as devastating and harmful as any other addiction. And then it also includes the sexual betrayal as well.


So how did you, and that's probably a large question, but how did you take on that attitude of this? What I'm hearing is ownership, but maybe you put it a different way. Yeah. Well, I've always been an accountable person, I feel, but you know, I had some great training early on in AA 12 step and you know, that program and many like it are all about accountability, accepting responsibility, being aware you know, making amends.


And so, you know, if you continue to hang onto and harbor any vestige of excuse or rationalization or anything else, then you are not, you're unable to recover because what I found in recovery is that I needed to take myself down to the absolute foundation. All the studs had to come off. I had to rip down everything that had made me to that, who I was to that point because I had developed, and here we go with neurology again, but neuro, I had developed so many bad patterns that, that had reinforced themselves over the years that I needed to get rid of all those, shed those.


And, you know, we can talk about that a little bit more in a minute, but then once down to the foundation, I could then look at that foundation and decide, was my identity what I wanted it to be, which the answer was no. Did I want to change it to something else and rebuild the house on top of that new foundation of a new identity? And that's really what recovery is all about, is you've got to take it down to the point where you are humbled and you recognize and are fully aware of what's, what, what's happened, what's happened as a result of your addiction and that you will do anything to rebuild your life in a different way. And, and that includes, you know, no more holding on to pride and the things that may be wrapped up in these patterns that you've developed to that point.


And so, so yeah, that's really what it was about. And AA is very good about that. My sponsor was wonderful about, you know, pointing out to me when I was holding on to anything that would be unproductive going forward.


And so that, you know, that process, you know, and the act of hitting a bottom like I did is just really, you know, humbling. And I remember sitting in rehab asking myself, how the hell did I get here? And what, you know, I'm 52 years old at that time. And it's like, what, what is next? And I had no idea.


I mean, this is the only life I had known. And so I was willing to do anything, which is really the key to change is that you have to be open to taking all the suggestions, not fighting anymore, not figuring out, can you hold on to anything that you've brought with you to this point? And you need to start rebuilding from the ground up in a way that, you know, and it helps to have people that have been through this before to guide you and direct you. And the great thing about this process is that it all is traced back to the brain and the brain is very forgiving.


It allows us to take a mulligan and say, that wasn't great, or it hasn't been great, or it's not going great. And I've developed these neurological patterns in my brain, physiological connections of neurons that represent all these different ways of being that are unhealthy. But these neurons aren't organized that way.


They don't have to be organized that way. They can change, reorganize themselves if I take the steps to help them reorganize, meaning I have to change how I think, feel and act. And then gradually that brain will begin to reorganize and reshape itself in a new, different way.


So yeah, thank God the brain is willing to change, adapt and evolve, which is neuroplasticity. That's one of the gifts of the brain. Yeah.


And it's, and we'll talk more about the neuroscience for sure. And I, one of the things that you said is this process of recovery that really requires a ripping out of all of these different habit structures and attitudes, behaviors that we've built in our life as a whole. I think I went through the 12-step process as well.


I went through it twice. The first time around was not very serious. I thought I was, you know, yeah, I'll do this.


And I already know most of the stuff. And so I'll give it a go. The second time was very much after my own rock bottom, which happened far later than I would have anticipated.


It was years into my recovery when I realized I still had an addictive mindset and it was causing very deep pain for my loved ones, my wife especially. And I realized I have so far to go. And it was that same feeling that you talk about of how did I end up here? How, how can I possibly be in this space right now? I thought I had things figured out.


And it's that ripping away of, in a lot of ways, kind of what I thought made me, me, right? I think I had these underlying beliefs of I'm a smart person and I'm a kind person. And those are like really positive things. But I realized how many decisions, especially when I went through my step four and five, how many decisions I had made in my life that were neither smart nor kind.


They were very foolish and very unkind, mean, rude, selfish, self-centered. And I had to take a good look at my life and that journaling process, that writing out that inventory of your whole life. That was so powerful for me to be able to step back and to realize I have not lived up to what I thought I was, what I thought I was aiming for.


And that left me in a space for a bit of, of feeling shame and sorry for myself and all that, those things. But then soon after getting to a space of that acceptance of, okay, I see where I am. What do I want to create now? What do I want to build? And who do I want to be? And that really is just getting down to that very foundation.


That's what I felt like. I felt like everything had been ripped out from under me. My whole foundation had been just essentially removed.


And I was like, what am I left with now? It, it, um, it can be very freeing. I mean, I actually felt, um, because these old patterns, these old ways of being, thinking, feeling, acting, um, especially when they're unhelpful and unwanted and don't serve us well and have consequences and are causing people around us pain. Um, there's a big weight attached to that, right? I mean, not a lot of us get a lot of joy from being an asshole.


Um, you know, there's just nothing good in that. And so the idea that you can, if you can truly shed all of that, all of your ego, everything that's holding onto any vestige of who you were, um, it's very liberating because the weight is gone. It's uncertain because you don't know what's next and you don't even know there can be a next or how that would even come about.


Like, can we, you know, this whole idea, can people actually change? And then you hear half the people say yes, half the people say no. Well, thank God for science. Um, it is proven that we can change.


And so, um, I mean, there are certain very primitive, um, wiring that we have, uh, the need to survive, the need to socialize, the need, you know, and very, there's psychological primitives. Okay. That we were born with, but all of our thoughts, feelings, emotions, actions, all of that is malleable.


Um, so really our personalities, um, even the stuff we're born with from our parents, you know, we're, we're given some predisposition that way, but you know, if, if what we were given, we don't like, and we wanted to change it, even the stuff that we were born with can be, um, massaged and, and, uh, and formed and, and work with over the years. And that's all through the process of neuroscience. Um, reorganizing our neurons through our, through new, more helpful thoughts, feelings, and actions.


And, and I think a lot of people feel, um, especially perhaps, especially in Western society will feel like victims to their genetics. Right. I, I came with such and such building blocks.


This is just the way that I am. This is how my dad was, or, or they can feel, um, I think there's certainly the message, especially when it comes to mental illnesses like anxiety or depression or, or addiction. Right.


And, and, uh, a, um, chemical imbalance in the brain that this is the way I am. This is the way that I will always be. And almost without question that this is, this is how, this is what I'll always feel like.


And I just need to accept it and deal with it. I'm a victim to it. Would you say that's true? And do you, how do you see that? Um, what's possible versus what's not? Yeah.


So this, I need to be a little careful just because I'm not a psychiatrist and there are things that we're born with. If, if they are imbalances that we're born with and maybe can't be, uh, that, that need to be addressed through medication, that's, that's one thing. I'm one of those people.


I have imbalances of, you know, brain chemistry, I'm very low on serotonin. And so I need to take medication to help, uh, enhance that imbalance or, or balance it. Um, so there is that.


Um, and, you know, thank God we're, we live in today's world where those treatments can be available. That's part of it. But there's also, you know, so much that we do have control over, um, if we understand how and have the motivation and commitment to see it through.


I mean, so many people in this, that's where this idea of change comes about, um, don't change because they don't want to invest the motivation and commitment into seeing it through until it becomes habitual and lifestyle oriented. And so that's this whole idea of the brain, uh, love its main job is to make sure that you survive, that you're safe. It loves familiarity because it doesn't know the, if the unfamiliar is going to threaten you.


So, but so the idea of change, it doesn't know what that looks like yet. And so it's resistant to go there. It doesn't even matter what it is because it doesn't know it yet.


It hasn't been introduced to it. And so that's where we have to have the motivation commitment to work through all that until the brain experiences enough of what this change begins to look like and gets enough feel good chemical neurotransmitter, um, to, to reinforce it. And then it says, wow, this change wasn't as bad as I thought it was going to be.


And it actually feels pretty good. It's a whole lot better than that old addictive lifestyle. Let's go do some more of that.


But that's where these, these initial, uh, processes of change are hard because they are so unfamiliar. Uh, the brain is resistant inherently. Um, and then, so therefore we have to create this change in our conscious mind and our, the front part of our brain is the prefrontal cortex where all of our executive control, our thinking, our decision-making, our impulse control, our judgment, our evaluation, all of this stuff that makes us like uniquely human.


Uh, almost half of our neurons in our brain are located in that area. Um, that is the, uh, part of the brain that has to work hard at this change. Okay.


That, that when you hear change is hard or when you find it to be hard, that's why is because we're having the, the body and brain are exerting a lot of resource in that part of our brain to make that change happen. And so, uh, the key to that is to stick with it long enough to identify enough reward around what this is going to be like once we get to the end. And then, um, you know, keep at it, keep practicing.


Uh, the brain loves repetition. So the brain is very much like the muscles in our body. When we go to the gym and rep our biceps over and over and over again, and we start to see, you know, changes and, and, and better muscle development, that that's the same with the same with the brain.


It loves to rep in order to know that things are safe, there's reward in it. And then these neurons start to develop and attach to one another that represent this change that you're trying to implement. And then they grow stronger like roots on a tree.


Uh, the more you rep it, the more you're fertilizing the roots, the more you're watering them. And then before you know it a few weeks, a few months down the road, you've got a whole new pattern developed and change is well underway. And that change begins to then become easier.


You don't have to work and think about it as hard. And it begins, begins to move from the front part of your brain, that conscious always have to work and think at it into the back part of the brain where the subconscious lives. And it joins all the other habits that you just know how to do automatically, like how to brush your teeth, how to ride a bike, you know, all those things that are just, you don't even have to think about it.


And that's the, the finish line in terms of where we want to get to for, for these new, new, new, new patterns is to have them transfer from the conscious part of the brain to the subconscious. And then they become a lifestyle. And I love that description, George.


And one of the things that I reflect on, as you say that, are the number of people that I've worked with who will tell me, and I have an understanding from a firsthand experience of this, having felt this exact way for years in my own addiction and subsequent attempts to recover, that there is kind of this response that some people might have to what you're saying, which is, well, that sounds great, George. And that's well and good that that's the science of it. And what you've seen to be true, but it's not true for me.


It's not the way that it works for me. I can't stay consistent with things. I can't build these habits.


I feel, I feel unable to do that. I, you know, I start trying to work on a habit and become consistent with it. And maybe I can keep that up for, for a few days or a week or even a month or two.


And then I always fail. I always end up capitulating, or I always end up, you know, taking several steps backwards and falling off the horse. What would you say to those people who struggle with that feeling of powerlessness or hopelessness or this inability to get consistent with something? Perhaps what have you seen is effective for you or, or what do you think would be helpful for them? Sure.


So all these change processes that we're discussing are scientifically proven. So, um, so in other words, they're wrong. They don't, well, I, you know, I'm, I'm not, you know, changes hard, as I just said, and these patterns that have been developed over these years that are, that we've now identified as unhelpful and unwanted again, think of them as roots at the bottom of a tree and these patterns that are really thick and that keep pulling us back are usually emotionally charged.


The ones that are emotionally charged have a lot of emotion attached to them, cause these neural pathways or roots to go really strong and they're powerful. And so, because even if they're unpleasant, the brain knows that they're familiar, they understand what being that way is like, and they know that you haven't died from it yet. And so even though they're unpleasant, it'd rather the brain would rather the familiar than the unfamiliar, because it doesn't know that the unfamiliar is not going to kill you.


And so that's scary, scary, right? What's unfamiliar is scary. Yeah. And that's the brain telling you that it's uncertain about what you're going to take it into won't be worse than this uncomfortableness that we're in right now.


That is what's happening neurologically. And that probably makes sense to people at a logical level. Okay.


So now, in order for us to change the brain, which wants reward, think of training your dog, not that we're dogs, although our midbrains are primitive midbrains that operate off reward, the reward network, very much acts like a dog. A dog is never going to learn a new behavior unless you treat it, right? Over and over and over again, until it begins to associate reward with that new thing that you want it to do. The same thing goes with our brains is that the reason that we don't stay with things is because we have not identified enough reward attached to that new way of being to have it be held those new pathways, right? Emotionally? Yes.


But that reward also has to be more significant, we have to create more subjective value out of that and really visualize and experience that reward in order to keep heading down this path of change. Because if the brain doesn't detect and experience sufficient reward along the way, that is willing to keep it going down that path of uncertainty, then it will stop. And so, you know, that's where a lot of this stuff, you know, that's what being stuck is, right? You're stuck in your patterns, and you don't, you feel like you can't change.


That's what stuck is. And so, that's why people work with guys like you and me, coaches, is because we can partner with them and guide them, reassure and guide them down this path, as long as it takes until they actually feel like they've, they're beginning to transform. And transform means, you know, dramatic shifting in one's behavior that is, or experiences that is sustainable and long lasting.


And so, you know, that's a lot of this, this shifting and transformational processes and changing happens, you know, usually it's, you know, 180 days, depending on how much motivation and commitment you have, how many other things you have going on in your life, how much time you can spend on focusing on this change. But you're looking at staying with something, you know, for a good 90 plus days, and it has to be reinforced constantly. There's a process in which the brain must follow in order for it to get over the hump past the point of, you know, having to work at this so hard.


And one of the things that I think about when you say that, George, is, you know, one of the things that I emphasize with clients is gratitude and power of gratitude. I think that exactly what you're saying with when it comes to habits, there needs to be emotion involved, right? In order to feel the reward for it to, for me to build in new pathways, it can't just be logical, I can't just go through the motions. And so gratitude is one of those keys or those tools that I found that works so well in after I do something that is what I'm aiming for.


It is my goal, no matter how small or big, it can be something little, really just even for 10 seconds, just feeling that gratitude of I did it, I accomplished it, this is positive, I achieved the goal that I'm aiming for, getting some of that emotion in there into this new habit structure, so that it's more of an emotional experience. And I, for me in my life for years now, actually, before I start something and after I finish, for me, it's both the gratitude and the good of others. Those are two of the things that I emphasize in a mindset, centering on how is this impacting the world in a positive way? How is this impacting others in a positive way? And what am I grateful for with it? That way, if I can insert this outward focus of meaning and blessing others and doing good in the world, and then also this gratitude that I feel, I'm shifting those habits, I'm shifting those patterns, because otherwise I can default to, this sucks, it's hard, I don't like it, it's difficult, where I think emphasizing, how is this making a positive difference in the world? Or how is this helping me feel better? What can I be grateful for about it? Really inserting that emotion.


Yeah. And when you sit in gratitude, and when you focus on how your actions are helping others, we feel great about ourselves. We get the surges of neurochemicals, these feel-good chemicals, endorphins, serotonin, dopamine, which all represent reward for the brain.


That's the brain's reward juice. And so the key here is to experience reward, whether it's in the form of gratitude, focus on how what you're doing is helping others, how what you're doing is aligning with this new identity and the values that you have identified for yourself, and do it a lot. So when we learned how to play golf, or took up a new language, or picked up an instrument for the first time, we didn't expect that we would be good at it in a week, a month, two months, we knew it was going to take some time.


And it was hard. Learning a new instrument, learning a new language is hard. We have to have the same, and by the way, all that learning is going on in the brain.


So learning how to be different, learning how to have new experiences, new thoughts, emotions, and actions and behaviors can be as hard as learning a language or learning an instrument. So if we look at it that way, and just stick with it, because we know that down the road, and as we're going, we practice these reinforcing reward activities like gratitude and focusing on how what we're doing benefits others. It's just incenting us, our brain, to keep with the process and keep heading down that path.


So I just think sometimes that we need to understand that this is a very gradual shifting and the brain, we have to partner with the brain and understand what the brain needs in order for it to get from point A to point B. And that's where coaching can help is because we can explain these concepts to people so that they can get their arms around them. Because otherwise, you're just in this process of trying to change and you're being pulled back because the brain wants to stay in the familiar and you don't know why you're frustrated and you don't know why, what's it going to take, why can't I stay with this? And if you can get some education around what's happening during these change processes and why you need to stick with it so long, and what needs to happen along the way for you to stick with it, that's very empowering and very, again, it's like lifting a weight off your shoulders because now you understand. Now you understand what it takes.


Yeah, exactly. And you mentioned some things earlier when you were talking about your story, George, with reference to what you used to be like and then how the addictions played into that. From a habits perspective or a psychological or emotional perspective or other areas that you reflect on, why do we go to addiction? What do you see is so consistent for people and why we seek out addiction in the first place? Well, I think addiction is a stress response.


So you're living your life. You've got a lot of uncomfortable thoughts and feelings. They're leading to actions that are not serving you well.


You might be flying off the handle, straining relationships, causing problems at work, and there's a lot of emotion, as you previously described, wrapped up in these things, and they're supercharged, and the ones that get really strong are the ones that have the high intensity emotion attached to them. And so this is our life, sometimes every moment of every day, and these things keep recurring. Every time they recur, they get stronger.


So it's a self-fulfilling prophecy, and we just get awful, and it's stressful. We're highly activated. The reason our brains get highly activated is because a lot of these things that we... The meaning that we attach to these thoughts and emotions, the brain says, well, we're under attack, our survival's at jeopardy, and we have to alert our systems to deliver the necessary resources to be able to fight or flight.


And so it's pulling on adrenaline, cortisol, the stress hormone, norepinephrine, all these chemicals which cause our system to activate, time to fight or flight. The problem is we're always in that state. And so the systems cannot handle... It's like you're sitting there in your car, revving your engine all day, every day, and there's no time for it to rest.


We're gonna wear out that way. And we're looking for relief. Again, our brain needs reward.


It's like, dude, you are stressing me out. I need some relief here. I'm gonna find it any way I can find it.


I remember that drinking and using drugs helps us all go away. And so the use of that as a coping mechanism for the constant activation, the constant stress response, and the constant survival instincts of the brain. And the problem is then once we start consuming and experiencing that reward, the amount of reward measured in dopamine particularly is so much higher than any other form of reward that we can get from natural life's pleasures that the brain automatically wants to pursue it because it loves reward.


And so that's that spiral that we get into where nothing else compares to the relief that we get from the drug or the alcohol because of the dopamine surge that we get. And so we just keep pursuing it. And then the brain is so over flooded with dopamine unnaturally that parts of it begin to shut down.


So we have to do more and more to get the same effect, which is tolerance. And then every time that we, because we're doing more and more, every time we stop doing it, we start to go through withdrawal, which is the drop of the dopamine level. Dopamine spikes to incredibly high level.


It starts to drop. We feel withdrawal. We'll do anything we can to feel normal again, which is a spike dopamine level.


So we've got to do more drugs because it's the only thing that will get us there. And so it's a malfunctioning of the whole reward system is what addiction is. But the reason we start using is to get relief from these, this discomfort that we feel mentally.


And that makes me reflect on my life. I remember, um, this may seem somewhat, somewhat unrelated, but it's, it certainly is related. When I was 16 years old, I had horrific acne so bad.


Like I probably at any given time had a hundred zits on my face. It was, it was, it was terribly painful. Um, not to mention what it did for me, self-esteem wise.


And uh, I remember I was at a, a doctor or a, I can't remember exactly, but some kind of specialist and I was speaking with them about my issues and they said, well, one of the main, uh, main places that acne comes from is stress. That's one of the underlying causes of acne. And they asked me, how are your stress levels? And I remember at 16, I was like, I don't really get stressed.


I mean, I think I'm, yeah, I think I'm really good generally. And years down the road, I remember as I was going through significant transformations emotionally, psychologically, spiritually, I was changing my nutrition and my physical health. I remember reflecting on that and realizing that I was always stressed out.


That's why I didn't know that I was stressed is because every second of every day, just like you said, that, that engine that's on overdrive is just, we're, we're constantly hitting that accelerator. It was on 24 seven other than when I was asleep, kind of. And it was social anxiety and anxiety and, and depression and all these things.


But really, if you look at the core of that from a psychological perspective, it was fear. I was in fear all of the time. I was feeling shame.


I'm not good enough. I don't match up. How do I compare to other people? This was a constant underlying theme of, of my brain and how I saw the world.


And that it's, it's no wonder to me that I sought out things like video games and porn and then eventually drugs and alcohol and food and all these things in order to numb that and try to bring myself up. As you're saying, increase my dopamine, increase serotonin, all these things, because I was in this state of constant overdrive and constant perfectionism and, and, and fear. Right.


That was just, that was just my life. Right. It was just how I always felt.


Yeah. And, you know, sounds like our stories are similar. Maybe I call it ice cream, right? All of us that grew up with this kind of discomfort and use and abused substances and behaviors to comfort ourselves, like it all kind of resembles each other.


The flavors might be a little different, but it all kind of looks and feels the same. And a lot of this, you know, in the rooms that I've been in and you know, all the people I've talked to, it all starts in childhood in some way, shape or form. And they're either discomforts that we're born with or experience environmentally from how our upbringing is.


And invariably we just don't feel good enough. Something's wrong with us. We're not acceptable the way we are.


And that leads into all of this negative thinking and feeling, and then all these behaviors that we use to act out as a result of it. And yeah. And so.


And I think one of the ways to understand it, it was, it's been very impactful for me is an IFS perspective on internal family systems. Don't know if you're familiar at all. But when I understood that we deal with pain primarily a lot of times either by inhibiting.


So in other words, I'm going to become more rigid, perfectionistic, can't make mistakes, need to do everything right. Or I need to become kind of this management of my life and ensuring that I don't experience suffering or complications, et cetera. Or through disinhibiting, which would be the impulsivity, the addictions, the behaviors that are highly rewarding, exciting novel.


These are ways to deal with pain, right? These are ways to deal with the underlying feelings of insecurity. Because I think for many years I felt all this horrible shame about what's wrong with me. Why do I go to these addictions? I'm such a morally flawed person.


And I think there's plenty of those messages out there. I think psychology can be so powerful when we then understand here's what's really going on. Here are so many of the root causes.


You're trying to, your brain is doing its very best to deal with the pain, the discomfort, the suffering that you're experiencing through this disinhibition, right? Through this impulsivity, these addictions, et cetera. Trying to fill that hole that is within you, as you say, either from things that you carried, right, into, you know, from birth or things that you picked up in your environment. And often it's both.


I think it's a combination. I think one of the things, George, that I definitely want to reflect on that was very powerful when I was speaking to you last time, just in our personal conversation, is the nutritional end of all of this. And nutritional science, because you have some insights, and you've done some things yourself diet transformation-wise.


And it's impacted your recovery. It's impacted your mindset. It's impacted your life.


Would love to talk about what things looked like for you nutritionally and how that integrates with neuroscience or psychology and how the brain functions and how that shifted for you. What kind of impacts that's made? So perhaps just starting with what were you eating like? What did your nutrition look like in the past? And how do you see that playing into your susceptibility to addiction, perhaps? Yeah. So going back to the brain, we just finished talking about how hard change can be.


And so one of the key things that we can do is giving the brain its best chance of success to operate at a function at a premium level and perform the type of change that we want to ask it to perform. And so we need to invest in the brain in all the ways that we can to give it the best chance of success. And so that includes not just diet and nutrition, but exercise, sleep, mindfulness, giving the brain moments of respite.


Because again, the brain is not really geared towards running at 6,000 RPMs all the time. And so we really need to understand how the brain works best and partner with it like we do with other parts of our body. I mean, we seem to give other parts of our body more respect than we give our brains.


The brains we just seem to take for granted and just assume it's going to be there performing without any investment in it. You know, we certainly spend a lot of time on our looks and, you know, all the things that are, you know, skin care and maybe going to the gym so our body looks better. But what are we doing around investing in conditioning and taking care of the brain? And so things like diet and nutrition are absolutely critical for the brain operating at peak performance.


You know, when we eat, how much we eat, the types of things that we eat are all super critical. And frankly, for anyone that's in recovery or trying to reinvent themselves or finding a better way of being, addressing all of these fundamentals is a really smart, holistic approach to making, you know, this new version of yourself become possible. It's almost like when you described earlier your first bout of a recovery where you kind of had one foot in and one foot out and what you got was not much of anything, right? I mean, recovery is one of those deals where you are either awing or you're kind of straddling and that's why what you hear about are like dry drunks, people that are sober, maybe not using or drinking, but they just are still miserable because they haven't recovered yet.


And sobriety and recovery are two completely different concepts. One is being abstinent, the other is becoming a whole different and better version of yourself. And so this concept of applying these concepts to every aspect of your life is really important because otherwise, let's say that you were practicing gratitude every day, which is a great mindfulness technique that gives your brain reward and helps reinforce new behaviors, but you were eating Captain Crunch all day.


Okay, to me, what that says is you've got one foot in and one foot out and the brain is going to not operate anywhere near at its peak level and not want to accompany you on this journey of change if you are flooding it with processed food, foods that are high in sugar, you know, having inflammatory effects on your brain, which actually cause impairments in the brain that are being linked to things such as, you know, cognitive decline, Alzheimer's, dementia, etc. So it really stands to reason that we apply a holistic, complete approach to recovery that includes everything we do with ourselves all day long, every day. And so, you know, with me, you know, I have a workout program.


I know what it's going to look like every single day. It's very intentional. I have about probably 12 to 15 foods that I eat all day, every day.


I don't eat anything out of a box. I don't eat anything out of a package. I eat whole foods.


And I don't really eat meals much anymore. I graze. I don't eat past the point of no longer being hungry.


I used to stuff my face because my relationship with food was about comfort. It was just like a drug or a drink. It was about trying to feel better in whatever way that I thought that was.


And being an addictive person, if I knew that food was going to give my brain reward, well, why not eat more because that's more reward? That's kind of the way that I guess I looked at it. I'm not even sure I thought that much about it. All I knew was all my body felt, my brain felt it.


I'm an addict. I'm uncomfortable. I need reward.


So I just ate whatever I wanted, whatever sounded good. This is a great example, an analogy of change in that if that's the way I was eating before, how was it that I was going to change that? And how was it that my brain was going to receive more reward from eating differently? So what it required was this gradual shift in changing my behaviors and actions and associating new and different rewards that would be more significant down the road towards eating better. And so I started really focusing on the types of foods I wanted to eat that would deliver a diverse macronutrient mix of the types of foods I needed to eat, the carbs, the proteins, and the fats, and the types of foods that I wanted to deliver those macronutrients.


So what you'll see me eating lots today are just lean proteins. I eat a ton of spinach and broccoli. I pick at olives.


I pick at nuts and seeds. I have a banana every day. I eat red grapes.


And there's probably a few more foods. And I just eat those foods every day, all day. And that's all I do.


And so those foods will deliver. And I'm very careful about how much I eat, never eating too much so that I don't get stuffed and full and tired. I just want to curb my hunger.


So everything's very intentional. You know, how much I'm eating, when I'm eating, what windows of time I'm eating in, what foods I'm eating. And what's happened is, is my brain has now, it was unknown, so it was uncomfortable.


But my brain now associates an incredible amount of reward with that type of eating because it aligns with my inner core values of wanting to be healthier and wanting to live with more intention and wanting to do the right thing and wanting to have a clear mind and clear body. And then as I headed down that path, I began to feel better. And I began to have more energy.


And so then it began to reinforce itself even more. Yes, and that's, it's mirror to my own experience, George. Hearing you say that, it's like, I get giddy inside.


I'm just, I'm like, it's so, what you're saying is so incredibly profound and important for, not just for sobriety, but for overall feeling happy and good in life. And I remember, and as you say, it's gradual. Over years of time, my, the importance I placed on food used to be, and this is how I approached many other aspects of my life, kind of all aspects of my life, was it was about how much pleasure can I glean from this experience? How much feeling of, feelings for me, right, of pleasure can I glean out of it? And over time with food and at the exact same time with all other areas of my life, it became, what can I do to bring the most meaning into my life, the most purpose? How can I live in a way that is intentional and based on real values that bring me joy, that bring the people around me joy in the long run? And with food, it changed from that, from pleasure to meaning.


It changed from, I want this food to make me feel good now, to I want this food to make me feel good in the long run, right? That it's going to actually help me and fuel all the other things that I want to do with my life. And I think that one of the things that became very, very frustrating for me as I was trying to make that change and one of my motivations was, I saw how much food was inhibiting me from being able to do the other things I wanted to in my life. The more processed food I ate and all sorts of different, you know, sugary foods, etc.


I couldn't do the other things with my life that I wanted to, right? I had ambitions. I wanted to make differences in people's lives. I wanted to show up with energy and excitement and love.


I could not do that if I was eating foods that were not good for my body. And so I became more and more and more conscious of how does this food make me feel? And that for me now is probably, I would say 85% to 90% of why I eat is, what does this make me feel like inside? What's it doing for me? How is it fueling the other things I want to do in life? And then that 10% to 15% is, yeah, I enjoy food. Eating food is pleasurable, right? And that's a massive shift from where things used to be, which was probably the opposite, right? Of about 90% was the pleasure of what this food is giving me.


And 10% is about how does it make me feel? I was not hardly cognizant of that. And I think, unfortunately, I think that's the case for a lot of people. And unfortunately, I think that there is not, there's very little to no messaging of what you eat impacts the way that you feel mentally, emotionally, your energy levels, how you show up every single day.


And I just simply can't do the things in my life that I want to do if I'm not eating right and putting in the fuel that I then get out, right? For the other things that I want to do in my life. And so for you, you have this very, what some people would maybe consider a highly restrictive diet. But for you, you're saying it feels, it doesn't feel that way.


It actually feels very pleasurable in the sense of this meaning, this purpose, this feels great for me. Would you say that's true? Absolutely. I mean, not all of these foods are the foods I love to eat.


So it's not like somebody, I went online and found a diet and said, you got to eat these foods. I simply wrote down a list of all the foods I love to eat. And in some cases, like I dress them up a little bit.


So, you know, when I have my spinach and I have a lot of spinach, I pour some vegetable stock in the little microwave bag that I'm going to steam it in. So that adds some flavor. And then it comes out, I put it in a bowl.


I add some Parmesan cheese, which is, you know, one of the best cheeses you can have because it's hard cheese and much lower in fat than other forms of cheese. I add lemon and I add a little bit of salt. And so by the time I'm done with it, it's fabulous.


It's delivering all kinds of nutrients. You know, it sounds delicious. It sounds amazing.


And it is. It's like I'd rather have that than anything else. So it's actually I'm actually enjoying these foods and the more that you eat them and associate gratitude around eating them and experience the reward of how it makes you feel not just from a physical standpoint and mental standpoint, but the fact that it aligns with your values and who the identity of this person that you want to be because this new version of yourself is a package that is compiled of everything that you're going to do in your life all has to align together to you can't have some things that align and some things that don't otherwise you'll be a cross purposes of yourself and a constant conflict and that's not a good mental place to be in again.


We want to elude discomfort. We want to get into comfort by aligning everything with our core identity the way that we've now defined how we want it to be going forward. So you can't, you know, be eating like crap and exercising like a fiend.


You can't be, you know, getting three hours of sleep at night, but eating right like all of this has to come together, you know in a package to deliver a result that is in alignment with this new identity that you that you want for yourself. So I don't feel like I'm missing anything by eating this way. I actually feel like I'm getting more out of eating.


My relationship with eating has changed completely like you were describing. It's a complete mindset shift instead of the getting like maybe spikes of dopamine from eating a bunch of crap food, which I know is going to spike up and then dissipate and then I'm going to feel guilty. Now, I get more serotonin, which is that feel-good meaning chemical that wells up within you from the heart and the soul and stays with you longer.


It's not a spiky thing. It's just it's a thing that when you feel goosebumps, that's serotonin. It's that feel-good, wellness, well-being chemical that says, yeah, this is right.


This is in alignment with my values. This, there's no downside to this. It's all upside.


It's all positive. This is who I want to be. And so you start wrapping together all your life, building it, constructing it, with all of these approaches to the different things that you want to do in your life, you know, you know, you have to eat, sleep, you know, you know, so you start forming those in a way that aligns with your values and then putting other things in place that also will, you know, help you become that person that you want to be.


It's true. I, I can't agree with that enough. I mean really the, and I hadn't ever put, I hadn't ever thought about it quite that way and that everything you are doing is aligning with your values and becoming authentic as you possibly can.


And, and I think that it's important to say as well, my values and I, I wouldn't say my deepest values. I think my deepest values are, reflect how I live now, right? It's a bit, I'm not perfect in that, but it's the best of my ability, but the values that I was actively living on a daily basis were, you know, for my own pleasure, you know, getting me, getting mine and, and all those types of things that were, it was, it was not aligned with the type of life that deep, deep inside. I really, really wanted, it was more of those surface values quote unquote, that were misaligned with those deeper values.


Don't know if I'm quite tying that together properly, but yeah, look at how uncomfortable you were as a result. When, when you're at, when your thoughts, feelings and actions, you know, behaviors are not in alignment with that underlying core fabric of who you want to be. No wonder you're uncomfortable, right? Because then your, your, your, your representations of how you're experiencing the world are running in complete contrast from how you want to be.


No wonder you're uncomfortable. No wonder, you know, we want to use drugs and alcohol to get away from that discomfort. So again, change is all about taking the studs down, getting rid of all those old patterns, thoughts, feelings, actions, behaviors, and then reforming your life, reconstructing it in a way that is in alignment with that identity.


And it's, it's a, it's a constant dissonance, right? I think that's one way of describing, I was living in a constant state of dissonance. And when I was in addiction and all the other habits that I had, and it is this feeling of anxiety and fear. And oh, if only people knew what I was really like, and, you know, if, if people saw behind the, behind the scenes, behind this mask, they would see this very deeply flawed person.


I think one of the, the freeing aspects, and it's not just again, like you said, it's not just about sobriety, but it's about living with a, what I refer to as a mindset and lifestyle of recovery. When it, when your choices and your mindset and all these things can align and the better and better they align, the less and less fear I have. I don't need to hide things.


I can be authentic about who I am and, and speak the way that I see things. And I'm, that's all developing for all of us, right? We're not, none of us are, are perfect in that, but the closer and closer you can align, as you say, your values with your actual choices, it's like, well, now I'm at, I'm at peace in my relationships. And when I go out in public and when I talk to people, I can be who I am because I don't have all this crap that I'm hiding behind this, under the surface that I don't want anybody to see.


That is very, very freeing, very freeing. Yeah. And, and I, I describe and define recovery as the never ending pursuit of the best, becoming the best version of ourselves, that version that we identify for ourselves.


Now, this is a path that we get on and the path is not fresh asphalt. It is, it's, you know, it's made of cobblestone and so it can be a little bumpy and that's okay because at the end of the day, we are humans and humans are inherently, you know, flawed. Nobody's perfect.


And so what it is, is this pursuit of trying to minimize the number of imperfections and the severity of them and giving yourself grace when you are imperfect, but staying on the path and, you know, don't fall off the path. Don't get stuck in a pothole. We have to keep moving and like you say, it's this mindset of a never-ending pursuit.


That means it never ends. You never get someplace. There's never a finish line.


I think there's only been five truly enlightened people ever in the world. I don't remember all five, but it's like the mother, Mother Teresa's and the Gandhi's of the world. And even they might claim that, you know, they were imperfect as well, but the rest of us are just on this path trying to see where it leads and actually there's just a ton of joy in being on the path.


You know, it's amazing how less, fewer bad things happen to you, how less dramatic your life is, how much more, how people like you a lot more when you're on this path because you know, you're just trying to do what's right and being the best version of yourself. And so there's joy in that and you feel it that you get, you get reward from that. These neurotransmitters inside of you are firing and signals are being released that you're on the right path.


You feel good about yourself because you know, you're in alignment with your values. I couldn't have said it better myself, George. I love that.


Is there anything else that you feel we haven't touched on or spoken about today that you want to share with people and make sure they hear? Yeah, just you know, a note of encouragement and hope in that, you know, no matter how bad you are at this moment, how stuck you feel, the level of discomfort, Jake and I will both tell you that there is a way up. I sat in rehab listening to these people that would come in and speak and tell us bright-eyed and they were as miserable as I had been at one point in their life telling me that there was a different way and I didn't believe it. I just couldn't imagine it.


But I said, okay, you're all I got and so I'm in, you know, and then I just took the small baby steps of doing what I was told, what was suggested to me. It led me down this, it got me on this path of recovery of which I've never stepped off of and it's taken me down all kinds of paths that I never thought were possible. It's taken me into the brain to understand all how all this change actually happens and thank God the brain is forgiving and willing to give us a second chance and to reinvent itself.


It's there for you to partner with but you know, what you have to bring is motivation and commitment. The rest can, you know, there's hope out there to help you with the rest but you just have to find it within you to be motivated and committed to, you know, make this change happen for yourself, but it's possible. Love that.


It's true. Well, thank you for saying that George and where can people find you if they want to get in touch with you? Yeah, I'm on LinkedIn. My name is George Haymaker on LinkedIn, but also my website georgehaymaker.com. H-A-Y-M-A-K-E-R.


Bunch of information there as well as a link for a free discovery call. We can talk for 30 minutes for free to talk about your situation and just see if we're a good fit to work together. Love it.


Love it. Well, so many excellent pieces of wisdom today, George. I appreciate you being vulnerable and open and showing, you know, being able to share with people so many things that are important for them to hear and it's just such a personal pleasure for me to have you on the show and have this discussion.


It was awesome for me. I'm grateful Jake and I feel all kinds of great neurochemicals going on in my body and my brain and all this reward going. I think I'm going to stay on the path for one more day at least.


I love it. That's right. Take another 24 hours.


There you go. Take them off. Very good.


Well, thank you so much, George. You bet, Jake.


 
 
 

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